😞 SRAM can’t trickle down – The new FORCE & RIVAL

😞 SRAM can’t trickle down – The new FORCE & RIVAL

2025 looks to be the year of the groupset
launches. It was just a week ago. We were here with the Campagnolo
Super Record launch. And exactly the same day, Shimano drops the new wireless XTR
on the mountain bike side. And here we are today. And SRAM have brought out the new force
and rival road and gravel groupset all at the same time. And I mean now
we must be looking at things, thinking where does everything
sit in the hierarchy? There’s going to be some fantastic tech
deals out there on bikes and groupset. What should I buy? Is it even worth it?
What they’re even doing? I’ve titled this video
Sram does not know how to trickle down their technology,
because there’s some stuff in here that is just excellent
and disappointing in equal measures. And I’ve got some Dura-Ace
and some Ultegra bits here as well. I want to sort of highlight some weight. So you guys really understand where
I’m coming from. This video is not going to be a YouTuber
weighing everything and analyzing the price. This is me trying to conceptualize where the best bang for your buck
is where the hierarchy sits. But here’s my thinking right this second before we get into
this is Sram red for a long time. Enjoyed the dominance the best groupset on
the market was the lightest. It was the most expensive. Yes, Campagnolo had an offer there,
but it was just pie in the sky. It just wasn’t worth looking at. Now Campagnolo have super record
at that top. Had Sram Red has a really valid competitor
and we can’t wait to see that roll down Dura-Ace, even though it is a top
tier of the Shimano range, was only ever a competitor with Sram force in terms of weight and price,
and that’s what they’re launching today. Remember,
Dura Ace and Ultegra are now four five years old
and a desperate for a rerelease. And now we’ve seen Shimano Drop Wireless. That cannot be far away. But then of course we have rival,
which should be the Ultegra competitor. I don’t think it is. right. Let me get into it. And I really want you guys
to get into the comments and get stuck in, because I really feel like the comment
section of this video is probably going to be more interesting
and more useful than this video. Let’s start at crankset now and Sram force. This is the new design
keeping with the carbon cranks. Have updated the design slightly. We’ve now got this parallelogram
type assembly here. The chainrings go to a one piece,
a bit like the Cannondale spider rings. It’s all machines. You can’t replace the inner on the outer
chainring. It is one
just keeping with the eight bolt. But the big news here is on the power
meter version, which I don’t have with me. It’s if you remember, Sram Red had that
power meter built into the chainrings. They’ve done away with that idea
with strong force. I think that’s a bit of an off
the site site. I’ll show you why. The second their argument is, is that
if you wanted the absolute the best, the stiffest, etc., then you had to build
the power meter into the chainrings. SRAM Force is meant to be a tear down. It doesn’t need to happen, but I think that is
indeed a reflection of their feedback. You see, even though they launched
a 50% off trade in program i.e. if your chainrings
wear out on your Sram Red, you take your chainrings into a dealer
and you get a 50% off the price of a new set of chain rings
with power meter. Still didn’t sit very comfortably
in terms of sustainability with the SRAM Force, now and rival
actually they now have the power meter stays with the crank
and you just change your chain rings. You are going to need though. This is what I mean about afterthought
is this chain tool that they brought out for that Sram
Red XPLR if you remember. So you can unscrew the chain rings
from the axle. They’ve actually updated this tool. So they never really had that in mind
until they really had to. So unfortunately bike shops you’re going
to need to buy a new one of these. Anyway, back to this
and I’ll show you what I mean about these weights because Sram force. Let’s just turn my scales on here. These are always pretty tasty and light. And this is probably where the bulk
of the weight of your groupset sits. And we have 627g. Now, if you’ve been following this channel
where we measure in the Sram red and those Seabury cranks, you’ll know that
is an incredibly lightweight crankset. Now, just for comparison, here is Shimano Dura-Ace. Still a compact. So pretty much the same gear ratios. And we are at 684. So this is what I mean
by Dura-Ace is actually more comparable to surround force. Now let me get into this rival groupset
because rival should be the equivalent of Ultegra. But Tiger here is an
I’ll take the crank set with preload bolt. This one is slightly worn, but this is 711g, so a little bit
heavier than the Dura-Ace, mostly because on Dura-Ace they have the hollow,
force on the left crank. And they don’t do that on the ultegra. So but this is the Sram rival crankset. So still using that
same one piece chainring. So the inner and the outer
all one piece machined. And then this sort of
I think that is called forged might be forged a crankset. And it feels heavy even though they tried
to take out some whitefly. This sort of whole design, it looks like
a powder coated chunk of aluminum. And the weight on this is. 792 significantly heavier than Ultegra. In fact, it’s actually probably heavier
than Shimano 105. And that doesn’t make sense
because Sram rival is coming in around the £1500 pound mark, which is more on par
with the price of Ultegra. And yet it’s at what I five
weight and features. So talking to features
and aside from general weight, what are the features that we’re getting? Well so I’m force
Sram actually have trickled down the tech from their red range. So you’ll recognize this rear cage. You’ve got the oversize
bottom pretty well. Some good bearings in there that spin
nicely and it’s nicely stripped out. It looks very similar to Sram Red. That is evidence of trickle down. The same way the cassette again doesn’t not look too
dissimilar to Sram Red, maybe just a little bit less machining,
but keeping it a little bit cheaper. And a little bit heavier. And then on the levers, I mean, this is the stuff
that we were all waiting for. We’re basically just waiting
for the lever, tech to roll down. And that’s what I’m really happy about. This is the only lever I know of that
you can get a legit four fingers around. You know, when you’re hitting a rough bit
around, you can just grab hold of a full fistful of handlebar,
get control of your bike. More to the point, with three fingers
you can legitimately one finger brake without your brake lever
hitting your knuckles here. So that is for me the killer feature. So with Sram, when they trickle down, you keep the bonus button,
but you lose the bike point adjuster. You still have the reach adjusted little screw there,
but you lose that one feature. And down here at the caliper
you can see it looks very similar to Sram Red, but it’s just not been quite
as hollowed out. Hasn’t had quite as much time
in the machine shop. To drop that weight. And then Sram rival, they just seem to have completely forgotten
about the whole trickle down. And the Sram rival
literally looks like Old Force. They really haven’t carried any over
any of those features. So the things that they waxed lyrical
about was the big feature upgrades at Red. They just haven’t applied to it. I mean, this is really an old force,
and it is basically a carbon copy of rival,
and the weight is not there either. I mean, this is a heavy lump of a mech
here, about 372g. I mean, what a real shame. It’s just like that trickle down
hasn’t been applied now on the levers have tried because for keeping with the carbon
lever on rival. But you lose both the bike
point adjust and the bonus button. Now for me this is probably the redeeming
feature of Sram rival. It is probably the thing
that’s worth upgrading. So if you’ve got a current Sram drivetrain,
but you just want to get those really good lever ergonomics, just by the lever
is probably going to be the best upgrade. Now if you buy them as a set
with the brake calipers, that £250, I think you’ll be able to buy
these as a separate lever. I just don’t have the actual price
for that just yet. But you can see here the calipers. Basically,
I’ve had no machine in the tool. That’s
probably where the bulk of the weight in. So even though this loses a bonus button, they still come in
slightly heavier than the force version. Now front Max, this is probably the big news really,
because Sram, always famous have been terrible
front shifted. And they fix that with Sram red
and you’d be glad to know that they’ve rolled down that technology
to both force and rival. In fact, there is no difference
in the front max at all. They are exactly the same
and exactly the same weight as well. 153g precisely. So for me right
now, had that question in my mind. If you’re buying a whole groupset,
nothing from the Sram rival range really makes sense,
but did a bit of a mix in a match in. I think you can get
into a pretty good groupset like the Sram. Rival levers
I think are a great way of saving weight and money
and still getting an excellent lever. Ergonomics. But the front mech I would pair with it,
then the rear mech. I’ll probably just use that as an upgrade
to the four system and possibly even the cassette, and then actually look
for an aftermarket crankset. You know, there are actually quite a lot of stuff
out there where you could really strip the majority of the weight
out of a Sram rival groupset by just not, well, by ignoring that
crankset altogether, I really I really don’t think this was Sram’s
finest moment. I mean, this should really be a groupset
that’s labeled apex, you know, with, with this,
I just feel like this is an apex level groupset
and not a rival level groupset. Should be five 600 pound cheaper, should be more like a 105 competitor. It’s definitely not an Ultegra competitor. Okay. That’s my thoughts on the road range,
very quickly on gravel. We don’t have everything here. But big news is that T type,
this direct mount that goes onto your Sram,
is coming all the way down to rival level. I don’t have a force version here. Or the cassette, but you guys will get
a 13 speed rival cassette. Now, this is where I think the gravel market is going to win
with the launch of wrath, Sram rival, because once you get those fantastic lever
ergonomics, you know, which are really good for gravel,
really can get a good handful of handlebar and really get control of the brakes
when you’re hitting the rough stuff. And I think if your frame can take it,
this is a great upgrade for gravel. My little concern with
this is we roll this down. Is that an awful lot of bikes. And I’ll come in equipped with updates
so that you can fit one of these. But I mean, look at the size of it. It is a big, chunky, strong unit. It’s designed to take a big impact. Brilliant for mountain bikes, some of the road bikes and gravel bikes
that we are seeing with us. I really don’t feel, strong enough or reinforced enough to handle the impact that will be transferred to the frame
with something like this. I maybe I’m wrong,
but this feels very dangerous to me. Probably should have stayed in mountain
bike territory. Who knows? Only time will tell. Now there’s one more thing here
which I want to talk about. And that is, We are
clearly in the wireless generation now. I really don’t think it is going to be
long before Shimano roll wireless across Dura-Ace and whatever it is
that they’re going to do. And I really think this is going to be
the generation where we start seeing frame design develop even further. Remember,
we saw when disc brakes became a big thing and we started experimenting
with wider wheels and wider tires. Now we are removing the need for running
a cable through your chainstay. So maybe,
maybe we can, after all, reinforce those chainstays enough
to have things like this on our frames. And also we’re removing
the need to have a battery somewhere. We’ve already seen that Colnago V5 is where you had to stick the battery up
behind the bottom bracket. I think the wireless generation
is going to give frame designers another level of freedom
to give us something new in bicycle frame technology,
who knows where it will all go? Oh, right. Before
I go, a lot of bits of housekeeping. Alongside all this, there are also some aero chainrings
for both gravel and time trial. That’s pretty cool to see. There is also a purple chain,
so the chains that they’re launching with this have been stripped
out of a bit of weight as well. So even the rival
one gets some more machining out there or some stamping rather on the chain
to cut some weight. And the purple
theme is really going to run through, and it’s even brought out a a purple koru
to match your purple chain. Sadly, I don’t have any here. At launch, all the prices, etc. are all going to be on various internet
of some websites and YouTube channels, but for me this is an understanding where I think the hierarchy is. And to finish this video off,
this is my understanding right now. Campagnolo Super Record and Sram Red
really are duking it out at the very top. Those two, it’s going to be really, really tough decision if you’re really
after the best of the best. And that might just come down
to very small details about how your personal preference around
lever ergonomics or brand affiliation. I think Sram force right now is definitely leading Shimano Dura-Ace. Apart from the fact that Dura-Ace is now
pretty much on sale as we anticipate
the launch of a new version of Dura-Ace. But I really think that Sram force
Dura-Ace, potentially Campagnolo chorus. When that launches, that’s going to be
a really tough decision around that. 2500 pound mark for a groupset
after that I think Ultegra. I think Sram have literally left the door wide open for Ultegra
to just walk in there. At any sort of price point,
Ultegra can probably launch now at around 18 to £1900 and still look like fantastic value
compared to its next competitor. Rival to me, looks like
it should have been branded apex, which means that I still think
that what I find fits in that Sram sound, which I would like for Dura-Ace ultegra
what I five and then rival. I think that whole mid market, I think
Sram have just gifted it to Shimano. I think this rival groupset
has probably made apex kind of irrelevant. So there we go. There. My thoughts I am desperate
to hear what your thoughts are. I know that you guys are going to have
loads and loads of opinions on all this. I get them down in the comments. I say that’s probably gonna be
the most interesting part of this video. So if you like this sort of video, please
think about subscribing to the channel. And if we get lots more subscribers,
we can bring you more content like this. Opinion pieces and ideas. And when we tear down and we build it onto frames and show you
the nitty gritty of these groupset, not just the headline weights and prices. And please think about liking this video
and share it with your friends. I’ll see you on the next one where we try and build this little beauty up. Who?

Everything in this video was bought by us for stock. SRAM had no say in this video.

17th June 2025, SRAM Launch the update Force Road, Rival Road, Force XPLR and Rival XPLR groupsets. This is our first look at the range, and we discus how it fit with the current and potential future offer from Shimano and Campagnolo. I am critical at how they have choosen to trickle down the tech from the Red range.

The video concludes with my opinion that SRAM Red and Campagnolo Super Record dominate the top tier.

SRAM Force and Shimano Dura Ace are a close match up

Then Shimano dominate the mid tier with Ultegra and 105 being no match for anything else on the market.

SRAM Rival and Apex, is too heavy and over priced to be a compelling choice.

00:00 Intro
02:14 SRAM Force 2025 Road
04:53 SRAM Rival 2025 Road
06:56 Levers
11:02 A look at Gravel
12:39 Conclusions